The Java Jive

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder
~ Ansel Adam? ~

“The only lasting beauty is the beauty of the heart.”
~ Rumi ~

Just goes to show how westerners aren’t at all superficial

all woman is pretty…
the statement is not exaclty right….(I think) coz.. many Indonesian Actress married with “white bule”

beauty is in the eye of the beerholder

Anyway, some Indonesian guys i know prefer fair-skinned gal, dont know if it has anything to do with class etc.

that depends on what kind of westerners. be honest javajive, you wont pick up ur housemaid anyway… if so, you will dress her up for improvement…

But, i’m sure that u’ll be happy when hang out with Anggun, and prefer to reject any sexual contact with the sister of Mandra, Omas… LoL

Ok, you guys do realize – I DIDN’T WRITE THIS POST right? I was simply linking to an excerpt from his writing. I definitely don’t fall into that line of thought – I just wanted to see how it was taken by Indonesians themselves, rather than a long term expat’s point of view.

Seriously, if bules wanna marry their maids, I think it’s great! (hopefully) it will improve the maids’ social economic status and probably improve the chance of better education of their children. Well, that’s if the bule doesn’t run off to his home country after the expatriation period ended, leaving the wife & kids stranded here.

Anyway, agree about beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I don’t really associate beauty with the color of the skin though, the issue lies on bone structures.

And yes, depends on the bules, too. If they’re some kind of expats making some ridiculously huge salary, most of them ended up with Indonesian celebrities or models or actresses or socialites or whatever they are.

Somehow I don’t think any of these ‘Bules’ are marrying their maids This is a topic I’ve seen in all of the Asian counries I’ve worked in (Vietnam, Thailand and now Indonesia). For a lot of expats it’s actually difficult in all of these countries to form realtionships with women from the middle and upper classes. I’m not entirely sure that there’s any specific physical preference manifesting itself. Most expats would happily form a relationship with a light skinned girl from a middle class family if they met them with the same regularity as they meet girls from poorer backgrounds (who often happen to have dark skin).

Hi guys!

I don’t know if you have read the comments on this article on Thang’s blog, but here are two:

baby said…
Mr.Thang, each woman even maid they have they own pretty and dont said that maid is meaning ugly. Please think twice before you put this article.
Don’t forget God create all the human, dont jugde “maid; dark skin; buck teeth; etc.” is meaning bad; maybe they are more good, better than you to apreciate another human being. (Who knows !!!!)
So no mistake with “white bule” and “dark Indonesian”… because it is good combination..for human.

Indi said…
i need to add:

“beauty is in the eyes of beerholder”

PS: talking about Indonesian peasants: you should check out their toes. due to centuries of working in ricefield barefooted, they have developed interesting looking toes: they are spread wider than yours and able to grip better in the deep mud than yours can! if you don’t believe me, try to walk barefooted on the banks of ricefields and I guarantee you will slip and fall. Them locals have physiologically adapted themselves into the situation by having customized toes.

check ‘em out!

And Thang responded:

Baby -

English is obviously a problem for you. If you have time and want to write or speak better English, I’d suggest that you take an English as a second language (ESL) course. I’m not sure what the market rate these days, but a friend of mine is an English teacher, and she has told me that some students of her are maids who work for bule bosses. Like them, I’m sure you can afford it.

In any case, with regard to your comment, I think you have missed the thesis (main point) of my article. I did not say that having buck teeth, a dark complexion, or a high forehead is a bad thing.

Rather, I said that, contrary to what most Asian men think, Western men find these features to be “exotic” and beautiful, and it is totally OK.

I am the one who is being fair here by showing the diverse (different) views of beauty. In fact, de facto, I was defending western men’s right to liking dark-skinned Indonesian women with hard-on-the-eyes features.

Here is the direct link to these comments:

http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=12524668&postID=115984602418128106

Enjoy aja!

I’m 100% Indonesian, without mix and match… so you can count on my reaction too… this issue nothing new at all. ppl talk about it everywhere in indonesia, since….. hmmmmm dunno…

santai ajalah…

I was talking about this to a friend of mine just recently… asking her why she thinks bule guys prefer the “pembantu” type, and instead of answering the question, she said if the pair had a child, the child would be genetically good-looking. Think of Tamara Blezynski(sp?) and Nadya Hutagalung, who are both physically beautiful.

Reaction such as this is nothing new. Oh, and it could be envy, since, as well all know, many local women here still think highly of western men and prefer them to local men, and the insult just proves their inability to get bule guys for themselves. Racist? Nahhh… it’s just a pride issue. Besides, it’s very Indonesian to be proud. (Oops.)

Regardless of the “controversy”, I know many many people (both Indonesian men and women and myself) who have concurred to Thang’s statement, yet I have never been able to explain why.

My opinion as Indonesian woman would be..

Nobody’s perfect that ppl always seek for better look over and over again. Dark skin is usually related to healthy skin, whereas fair skin is not. Yes according to science research, dark skin has lots of melanin to neutralize UV from the sunlight. No wonder fair-skin ladies are eager to get tanned. LOL. Maybe western guys love the healthy one. It’s okay. I’m cool with that.

As for me, I have yellow skin. *phew* not so bad, isn’t it? And I love white guys LOL!

Hm… this is a toughie. Having lived in the US only for 6 years and know a number of Indo-USA couples around the States, I can’t really generalized if bules [mostly] are marrying maid-like Indonesia ladies. I did observe that the higher of one bule’s social status, his wife looks less like a maid. Why do bules like the Indonesian dark skined, high forehead, and pointy nose females? Hey, I guess ‘exoticism’ is in the eye of the beholder

Well, rumor said that I am part Indonesian. And maybe I look like a maid too. But if my man treat me like a princess and not a maid. I would be careless what people said.

Very interesting post. I think Mr thang is a honest person, people just interpreted his words as offensive or something. I can tell you all I have listened to those comments “why westerners like ugly asian women?” SO MANY TIMES, probably millions of asians think so. It’s nothing to do with racism, it’s just the definition of beauty in different region. I know a lot of westerners like ‘exotic’ look of asian women, the more original look (or you can say kampung) the better they love, otherwise they can find those in their own countries anyway.
It’s that way. Asian women are more caring and shy and feminine and maybe more family oriented, westerners love them, western guys are more generous looking, more musculine, more gentlemen, less chauvenist (spelling?) and more hair! So so so, there are generally a lot of asian women westerner men couples, you all dont see many asian men with western women, right? And if you are in asia for sometime, you can actually see some women (called Sarung Party girl in Spore) who purposely dressed sexy just to attract western men, they hate being with local guys and will DO WHATEVER to get a western boyfriend, and for western guys who could be nobody in their own countries now getting so much attention, its like a BIG treat. For this case, I am not sure if the package they buy from each other is real or not.
Ok, I think I got carried away and a bit off topic. Oh, there is one more thing asian women may look for in western guy, which I don’t want to mention because I am an asian
All I can say is, the world works in a magical way
I really want to hear Brandon’s opinions on this.

The two men that are talking about what women are attractive both need to go otu with a sexy maid and stop being fuckheads.They are both disriminating against these lower class Indonesian girls.They both probably fuck prostitutes anyway.What fuckheads just the way they talk you can tell they are dickheads

I have been thinking about this topic since i was in Indonesia. Before i thought Bule just exoticise the idea of beauty. But delving into a deeper level, the concept of beauty is rather constructive and it may be fair to argue that this construction had something to do with an exhaustive process of colonisation, during which differentiating skin colour was an attempt to maintain this construction.

This construction, however, could give a sense of inferiority to Indonesians. They seemed to feel that bule are better than them. Some cartoon depicted ‘native’ in very demeaning way was commonly found when colonialism reached its peak. I think this representation then impacted on Indonesian seeing themselves as a subject. And from this, the concept of beauty was then a kind of projection of being equal to Bule.

Interestingly, bule were also amused to this ‘native’ and their cultures and landscape. They called them exotic, beautiful, unique, virgin and the like, particularly those who were sympathetic to native.

All and all, why do bule like Indonesian maid-look women and Indonesians prefer fair skin, blonde, and blue eyes is because the concept of beauty was rather a product of discourse during colonial period.

citu

Indonesian women are ugly. I think that it might be the only nation on the planet that hasnt been gifted with it’s share of beautiful women. It’s a rare thing to see a pretty indonesian woman. So sad.

Quang, you cant say that as you have obviously met my girlfriend Amanda. She is Indonesian and amazingly beautiful, and it is not only me that thinks this, many people have commented on this. (is not a maid or mail order! she was adopted and has lived in the UK since she was a small child) I think that you are very shallow minded to generalise like this.

Quang, you cant say that as you have obviously NOT met my girlfriend Amanda. She is Indonesian and amazingly beautiful, and it is not only me that thinks this, many people have commented on this. (is not a maid or mail order! she was adopted and has lived in the UK since she was a small child) I think that you are very shallow minded to generalise like this.

Quang,
haha you obviously have a very different point of view on beautiful women, but just an FYI, here are few of Indonesian women pics, real Indo women pictures that you can see yourself and I think they all are very beautiful.

http://www.dewa.com/big/a-d.shtml

Quang, If you truly hold that very bleak attitude so dear then i would pose one simple question to you. Why are you posting on this forum in the first place? Should you not be galavanting around the clubs of some metro area in the states instead? It seems you would be more likely to find what you are looking for their. some close minded, shallow, blonde airhead.

Western Men, Indonesian Women..

A friend of yours think so???
Depends on his perspective..
And also depends on d actor and d actress perspective..

Would be unattractive if they go out or marry for a fake reason…fancy…material or so…:)
But would be a precious moment if it is pure for love and desire to share the togetherness forever and ever…

It is too general, isnt it??
But what else?? That is it…
We can not refuse to say no…
but when love speaks…no matter love of $$ or love of love???..it could happen anywhere…anytime…not only in Indo…but also in Thai…Malay…Vietnam….mostly Philippine….!!!!

Watch outttttttttttt….
When love speaks…possibility would build its kingdom…:)

cheerssss
Frida

Western Men, Indonesian Women..

A friend of yours think so???
Depends on his perspective..
And also depends on d actor and d actress perspective..

Would be unattractive if they go out or marry for a fake reason…fancy…material or so…:)
But would be a precious moment if it is pure for love and desire to share the togetherness forever and ever…

It is too general, isnt it??
But what else?? That is it…
We can not refuse to say no…
but when love speaks…no matter love of $$ or love of love???..it could happen anywhere…anytime…not only in Indo…but also in Thai…Malay…Vietnam….mostly Philippine….!!!!

Watch outttttttttttt….
When love speaks…possibility would build its kingdom…:)

cheerssss
A-mild…enjoy aja lagiii..hehehe…
Frida

Hello Brandon,

I could sit here forever and read your blogs. Great job!

You can totally write a novel!

I’d like to include my 2 cents on the comments Nguyen’s friend made.

The statement rings all to similar to conversations I hear my husband (an Indonesian) and his friends have. Remarks such as, “Oh you like her? She looks like my servant” Thus leaving his poor friend discouraged at the opportunity of a date. So I asked him, “So looking like a servant is supposed to be an insult”? What is the definition of looking like a servant? Is it because someone is dark? In my opinion, the girl was actually pretty.
He replied with, “well that’s just the way it is, unfortunately people who are servants look like her”. Whoa, that was mean!

It remained a conundrum for all about 5 minutes and realized that it isn’t just Indonesians that have this shallow mentality. This method of thinking is all too common all over the world actually. Even in the United States. For example, the black people who are considered to be better looking, are always the lighter skinned folks like Beyonce, Tyra, and Halle Berry. In high school, the popular black girls and guys were also the lighter skinned ones too; with the exception of the athletes…

It’s the same in Africa too, all over South America and of course Asia. The light- skinned ones are thought to be prettier and richer. Mexico also has this philosophy and it’s similar to Indonesia’s but somewhat reversed. In Mexico there are many women who like to tan, but they still like to keep a western appearance by not looking too ethnic. In Indonesia, those that have a large disposable income tend to bleach their skin, even nipples, so that they can have a “pearly white” appearance. Their beauty standards are to have “western,” features without actually being white..

In telenovelas (Mexican soaps) the rich are always the “whiter” looking ones and the poor ones are always the dark indigenous people. Oh and god forbid you look “too white” to play a “poor village person” role. (Sound familiar?)
I also noticed when watching Indonesian movies, the actors/actresses portraying the upper class elite were also “fair skinned”.
I don’t think you guys get America’s Next top model over there in Indo, but last season they had a dark Indian girl named Anchal and she explained the pressures of being too dark and being called ugly while growing up. I thought she was the prettiest one their, yet she was so insecure she couldn’t see it.

Now, in my opinion beauty comes in all shapes and forms. Take Anchal for instance, dark and beautiful… I guess what I’m trying to say here is..
What defines beauty? Let me thesaurus the heck out of my MS Word for a second..

Okay,
BEAUTY: lovliness, attractiveness, good looks, prettiness, exquisite, gorgeous, splendor.

Pris

P.S I’m as white as they come; but I do love tanning…

Here’s a link to America’s Next Top Model Website in case you guys were curious..

http://www.cwtv.com/page/model3.html

I found a marriage site between western men and asian women, and some of them are Indonesian. None of them look like a ‘maid’ (read: ugly) if u curious about it they put their website as well so visit their personal site. Interesting. http://members.fortunecity.com/canzian/id.html

hi Brandon …. I found your site on net ….. I love your picture n I love your story.
I was born n raisen in Bandung , but since a couple years I’m living in Holland.
Beauty in asian eyes n bule eyes is not the same , white = beauty for asian people , stupid attitude , but you can’t deny it if you are born n raisen in asia.
Not only the color of your skin is important but your job is important too , not everyone will marry your own maid there but here …. is not really important it’s just a job.
You can find huge indonesian peoples here , I guess Indonesian peoples here judging their own peoples more then the bule , they are still having the same attitude just like in Indonesia, some ras found themself higher then the other ras.
For exam : Indonesian Chinese preffer to have Chinese or bule for their partner.
Their attitude is really anoying …… deuh ….. we are not living in asia anymore.
Some Indonesian peoples here are whorse …. they are really proud if their partner is an bule ….. come on …. not all bule that’s cute …. çouse if you living here for so long like I do you can see which one is cute bule and which one is geek bule …. :p

But like I said if you are born n raisen in asia you can deny it , My dad is chinese n my mom is dutch , Since I was in Indonesia I always see all the peoples is the same , no one better then the other no ras is beter then the other , I still have the same attitude , there are cute bule but you can find ugly bule too , there are cute asian with dark skin but there are the ugly one too.
I don’t choose my friends from their ras , color , job or whatever , but I preffer to have chinese guy for my partner I don’t know why …. maybe beacuse of my dad , I never like bule , I always find their skin are not really romantic with their hard white hair on their skin , in my eyes is just like ‘kulit babi’ …. ups not really openmind but that’s what in my mind …. bule for me is much better in movie then in real life.

I guess everyone have their own definition about what beauty mean ….. but it’s ok …. couse everyone have right to do that.

I read some of your blog [I want read more if I have more time] n I see all your picture …. you n your muse is a perfect couple both of you are cute :p …. enjoy each other n don’t bother to hear stupid attitude from stupid peoples.

Geez, all of you are so worked up on this topic!!! Thang was just voicing his opinion which was an opinion shared by most of us In Indonesia anyway. Come on!!!! I am sure you must have had uttered this opinion once or twice, privately or to a group of friends.

As for myself, I am of Indonesian decent, been living in Australia for a fair bit and the proud owner of dark complexion. Let’s put it this way, all my friends here in OZ always marvel at how brown my skin can be after half a day lying on the pool or the beach. An attempt which has to be done very carefully by my Anglo-Saxon friends here if they’d rather be brown, not red. During winter months, when I turn too pale, a bottle of ‘tanning moisturiser lotion’ is my best friend. It is fabulous to have healthy glowing golden brown skin amidst seas of pale complexions. The very same idea is also responsible for the massive selling of tan spray lotions and establishment of solariums in every street corner.

At the same token, I have experienced how girls in Asian countries I have visited including Indonesia love to don me the ‘look’ due to my complexion which can be rather too dark after weeks under the sun. What can I say? During the holidays, I am a sun worshipper and enjoy water sports. I will never swap witnessing beautiful marine life with my own eyes and lying on the soft sand with a glass of cocktail on my hand with ‘white skin’ which is favoured by most Asian ladies.

To my Indonesian sisters out there, you are gorgeous despite what a knob like Quang has said. Never limit yourself just because you think you are expected to look certain way by our so-called society. We live in a tropical nation which sprawls over 17,000 islands. We are bound to look different from one another. So do not use your beauty parameter to judge other culture as it will never justify it! Beauty is indeed in the eyes of beholder. Enjoy our tropical sun as we are so lucky to have it 365 days of the year. Just my two cents, fellas!

Don’t you guys have anything better to do? Crazy bules!! LOL
Btw i am a product of an Indonesian American mix marriage and I am good looking. Hahahaha.

I accidentally stumbled upon this while I was searching for Java to-dos. Great blogging you have here, excellent photos too. I am an Indonesia born American woman. Although I was born in Indonesia, I have lived in the U.S. for 18 years. I came when I was 5, returned to Indonesia for Junior and High School, and came back to the States for college and here I am, still here and been married twice — both to a Caucasian although I’ve dated a few African-Americans. My husband said I’m beautiful but I think I’m just like everybody else and here’s my thought and personal observation…

There is a big gap it seems in Indonesia between the rich and the poor, the beautiful and the not so beautiful, the educated and non-educated, the successful and not successful, and the list goes on. There are many in the middle but it seems like people either look one way or the other. Those not in the preferred group would want to move up to that. It’s like high school in a way. “Gengsi” is a big thing.

The Westerners I believe are more open minded to social boundaries. There are blue and white collar jobs but you see many couples from both types of jobs dating where in Indonesia, there’s a smaller chance of seeing an office employee dating a tukang becak. Although there might be chemistry, Indonesians, more so middle-upper class women, would turn around and remove the feelings. In her mind she’s thinking of what her parent and friends might say, what her future is like, etc.

My husband is in the AF and we see many older couples, Korean/Vietnamese/Filipino-American couples, shopping on the base. I can say that 90% fits Nguyen’s description of an unattractive woman. My husband would mention how unattractive the woman is on occassions but I always say that maybe she’s just a wonderful person and that’s what makes her beautiful. You can’t change how you look (well, I guess you can now with all those extreme makeovers) but you can change who you are inside and the beauty will show. What’s interesting is that 90% of their children will just be gorgeous and even the 10% are still attractive (this is to MY eyes).

Why did I choose a “bule” you might wonder? I wanted somebody who has a modern way of thinking. Just coincidently I married the white men. I was afraid that a non-westerner will not let me be who I want to be career wise and as a person. I am very independent and goal oriented and need somebody who can love me for who I am, do everything 50-50, and not feel less of a man and head of the family if I succeed.

Well, I am not sure what to say to these messages. I have returned back home from visiting Java in March-April this year….. As for the whole “looks” thing? I dunno, I am engaged to an Indonesian woman who isn’t bucktoothed, her skin is more yellow than coffee, but only because she makes a point of avoiding the sun. But she is the sweetest , most nurturing woman I have ever met. I tell her not to worry about her skin getting darker in the sun when we go out, but it has been a long battle to convince her that her more normal colour is beautiful. I would watch tv with her and snort when they would portray someone like Nicole Kidman as being gorgeous….. I would tell her that she wouldn’t get a second glance from me…. Now Halle Berry, Or Salma Hayek, or Zhang Ziyi …!!! Eventually, she seemed to understand that the whole bit of stereo-typing what is beautiful just doesn’t work. It all comes to personal tastes, and she is my favourite flavour. I tend to like a little more coffee in my woman’s color than others and maybe even less than some others. Now if I can just figure out how to deal with the Indonesian laws concerning foreigners, christian / muslim marriages, and all the rest of red tape that should really be changed to make it easier for people to be together…..

I’m Indonesian and guilty of saying that phrase more than a couple of times. I know it’s not politically correct to generalize, but I’ve never seen an affluent Indonesian man with an Indonesian woman who looks like the stereotypical ‘ugly native’ I’ve seen some bules with. I think it’s just a matter of taste. To Westerners, these girls might look more exotic because they truly look ‘Indonesian’. To Indonesians, well, they might look just ordinary.

My work sent me to the Nth west of Java, Indonesia, for 2 months. I found the Indonesian women lovely in both physical beauty and personality. Dark skin, light skin, who cares? In fact, I found the heavy tanned look hot.
To say the girls from the outer villages are ugly and have buck teeth or high foreheads is ridiculous. Many “western” men find both these features cute, so its true what they say, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Hi to all just a comment and a warning to any ‘bules’ who are contemplating marrying a nice middle to upper class Indonesian woman, as I was married to an Indonesian middle class gal her father comes from Ache and her mother comes from central Java she was a very beautiful woman when I meet her, dark velvety skin, long black hair, great boob, great body, 5’6’, 52kgs we were 100% compatible so I thought! She was quite, understanding perfect. But then she had our son and now she’s a fat ugly, lazy and you wouldn’t think twice at looking at her, well as you can perceive were not together anymore as she didn’t know or want to do anything you the housework, clean while I was working as she never had done anything for herself and was spoiled rotten all her life, you know with maids etc., but thank god that I realised what she was all about as my life would have ended in misery and despair!!! The moral of this story guys is marry into your own culture you will never go wrong and if you do well you will at least know where and when it’s going to go wrong…bum bum!!!

An addendum to my post and to that blog that appeared in certain Indonesian bloggersphere. The modern A typical Indonesian woman doesn’t like western men they are generally lazy and see bule men their pass of escape to a modern life and to achieve affluence that they think western culture will give them and also to do way better than their family. But the most important thing is to escape the misery, heat and pollution that is Indonesia! So they think! They don’t realise that when they come to the west they have to work 1000% harder then what they ever did in Indonesia!

Indonesia…Muslim Judge Blames Women’s Wickedness For Tsunami! Today’s Times reports on a disturbing phenomenon in the aftermath of the disaster – the blaming of women for causing the event, and forcing strict controls on women’s lives to avoid the risk of another disaster. Marluddin Jalil, who claims “The tsunami was because of the sins of the people of Aceh” Well what can you say about Indonesia then????

Being white i love brown skin, brown skinned people seem to want to have whiter skin. (I seen the products in the stores) I think Indonesian brown skinned women are beautiful. giddiup it doesn’t get any better

I recently went to Indonesia. It appears to me that Indonesians with money live in the same areas as those who don’t have money. The exception was a wealthy Chinese part of Jakarta. I also noticed that most television actors and actresses were fair skinned, except for those playing villains or clowns. I remembered several years ago when native Indonesians were killing and decapitating Chinese Indonesians for reasons I did not understand at the time. Now I get the picture. The whole thing reminds me of the racial divide in the United States prior to the 1970′s. Being a Jet Black African American, it saddens me to see Indonesians suffer self-hate spawned from the divide and conquer tactics of imperialism. I was only there for a couple of weeks. Please let me know if I got the whole thing wrong.

I just hope Quang read this one.
Quang, I think you’re a loser and that’s why no Indonesian girl ever like you and that really hurt your pride. That’s why you said that horrible thing about Indonesian girl. Well, get it over with already!!! Nobody wants an a**hole and you know that. Straighten up your attitude and maybe there’s a girl who would feel sorry for your sorry ass.

I am an American lady, who was dating this American man and he suddenly stopped dating me and started seeing a younger girl from Indonesia and married her within 2 months. I never have gotten over this. Any ideas why so fast marriage took off so fast? I was thinking maybe she just wants to live in America.

Dear Rhea, I can give you a million reasons. But, the reasons can vary from one person to the next. The most common theory is that Indonesian women and Asian women in general tend to be more on the submissive side, sweet, caring, and respectful. Some men dig the unknown and the exotic while others just want a mail order wife. I also feel that the American men (not all but most) have been rejected far too many times by American girls; only to be glorified like a god by women in a foreign country. This can apply to other countries in Asia and Latin America as well. As far as the beautiful thing goes, I think there are plenty of gorgeous women here in the United States. However, those gorgeous women are probably the ones who rejected those American guys who fled to Indonesia or Asia to find a wife. Not to be a snob but I’m one of those pretty rejecters. I had an American boyfriend too and totally dumped him so evilly. I saw him 6 months later with a mediocre looking Korean girl. The strong irony in this, is that I too am now married to an Asian (Indonesian).

Like I said there are a million reasons for your boyfriend’s actions. Maybe his reasons aren’t what I just listed and could be far more complicated than that. You can find those traits in an American girl too, you just have to look! A good example would be me… LOL Maybe I’m the exception to the rule but I come from an American family of strong values. I learned Bahasa, I cook Indonesian food, & according to my hubby I sometimes act more Indonesian than his friends. So I think that I’m not the only one out there like that. There are people like me you just have to find them. My husband also has had a bad experience with Indonesian girls; but that’s not to say they are all the same. His experience and indignation was that all the Indonesian girls he dated were spoiled, rich little daddy’s girls who couldn’t even find their way out of a paper bag. However, I wouldn’t be quick to judge all Indonesian women because those “rich daddies” girls don’t represent Indonesian women and Indonesia as a culture.

Nonetheless, please don’t feel it’s your fault I’m sure what he failed to appreciate in you, someone else will love. My husband is a good example of that, he appreciates a lot of things in me that other Indonesian men would despise and vice versa; many Asian women traits that are considered attractive to some American men might seem appalling to other American and Indonesian men.
For example, my American co-worker has the impression that Indonesian women are like slaves to their husbands and don’t have a mind of their own. Which is not true because I’m friends with an Indonesian couple and as far as I can see, the wife wears the pants in the family. Lol

Okay I’ll stop now, my post is getting too long and I’m only going to piss off the owner of this blog who happens to be a very attractive American guy married to gorgeous Indonesian women. A match made in heaven. lol

I don’t care much for what Thang wrote. He isn’t an Indonesian anyway, but tries to come across as one, but he seems to be quite racist, or perhaps even jealous. Maybe he can’t get a date? Who knows.

The majority in any country is poor, especially in Indonesia. I don’t care much for rich, spoiled “daddy’s girls” who only date bule men because they want to show off how “cool” they are.

I used to date a doctor at MMC and she was totally rich, but she would brag about her political connections, as if I really care anything about Agum Gumelar or Golkar in general. He’s not important to me.. just another Golkar Orde Baru guy probably as corrupt as the rest of the politicians around the world.

I found a great Indonesian woman, well educated and respectable, two years ago and made a promise to my Indonesian female friends that I would help them find a Western man. I know and can guarantee that they aren’t gold diggers, but rather, respectable, educated, career women.

I set up a website to help them, complete with a live chat box and if you are interested or know anyone who is interested, please visit my site:

http://findyourbulehusband.blogspot.com

Trims.

Paul

I can’t stand old, white, perverted men who go to Indonesia and other parts of Asia to find an Asian girl or girls to be with. The idea of “me luv you long time, mister” somewhat disgusts me.
Well, I do, however, occassionally say it as a joke.

I mean, I understand everyone has needs. And especially sexual needs. Therefore, anyone has the right to fulfil such necessity, regardless of whatever race.

But that friend of yours, Thang f*cking Nguyen should repricocate the idea…

The Indonesian women don’t look like maids.
The old, bald, unattractive white men look like disgusting, perverted pimps.

AND F*CKING TELL HIM…
INDONESIAN GUYS ARE UGLY!

For your information, Thang, I am financially independent, educated, classy, and fabolous.
And I am Indonesian.

Go suck a motherf*cking tiny Asian d*ck, you blind a$$hole.

(From Brandon: I edited some of the language slightly. )

What about guys who wants to find bule wives? Can they go to your website too? Do you get those kinda request?

I think we shouldn’t “attack” Thang Nguyen like that. I mean he only brought up something that many of us have been questioning every time we see a bule with a girl described by his friend. I mean everybody can have an opinion and it’s out of ignorance and sometimes the society that they say things like that (women with dark hair, buck teeth, high forehead, etc are ugly). Indonesian guys aren’t ugly, just shallow, like most of the people

Excuse-moi, Jane.
I believe every girl has the right to vent every once in a while.
We have the right to be passionately expressive about our repressed negative opinion about a guy who says a comment we dislike.

Excuse my French in the previous message. I haven’t cussed in a while. I guess swearing should be like desserts- great for every once in a while.

And Brandon…thank you for censoring my bad choice of words;)

p.s. No, Indonesian guys are not ugly. They’re just not my type.

Dear Nez,
I wasn’t talking about the language. I was talking about the fact that it was Thang Nguyen’s Indonesian friend -not Thang- who said that expats often like ugly women. That’s why I said Indo guys are shallow, at least, most of them.

P.S: I have nothing against self expression (like swearing). It’s fun to do every once in a while :p

I am Portuguese and I married an East Timorese-Chinese. I was talking with a young Indonesian woman once in Yogya and I happened to tell her that I had an East Timorese girlfriend. You should see the look in her face, she was really shocked and exclaimed “But she’s black then!”

It’s not only the men, it’s the women too, and the publicity and the show business… Something similar used to happen in Europe before the age of suntan chick. Being dark skinned meant you worked in the fields so a proper “high class” lady should be pale. There was even an ideal of beauty that said a woman should aspire to have a neck so white that red wine would be visible inside when she swallowed. In Indonesia there’s the issue of economic and social status and then there’s also the issue of ethnicity. Some people from some groups, like the Javanese, are not so found of people from the Eastern Islands who tend to be darker.

About the maid+bule thing there’s a really great short story from Pamoedya Ananta Toer you should read. It’s called “Jongos+Babu – sejarah keluarga yang sangat panjang” and you can find it in the book “Cerita dari Jakarta” (Tales from Djakarta).

I used to know a Portuguese guy – he was right wing and right wing people here are often racist – but this guy wasn’t, he liked to say: “In every people and every ethnic group there are girls who are gorgeous, so how could I be a racist?”

There are gorgeous women in Indonesia, as there are in other countries and peoples. And then it’s an issue of personal preferences. Some are attracted to blondes, some to brunettes, some to tall girls, some to short girls, some to Scandinavian valkyries and some to Indonesian Dewi Sinta types, some even hope to find their Sulasih somewhere in Asia…

Every country has “beautiful” and “ugly” women.
Indonesian is no exception; of course there are stand-outs on both side of the spectrum but for the most part, from what Ive seen, Indonesian women are very beautiful.

Oh well, i think it’s because women with maid kinda looks are easier to get.. than the more beautiful and fair kinda women, they definitely way more “high maintenance”.. i might be wrong but for some degree, i can see some truth in it no offense please..

I don’t think it is wise to judge or perhaps stereotype a whole person by her/his looks. Besides, how can you judge a person with “a fair-skinned one, who has the look of a financially independent, educated, and classy lady” must be a beautiful person inside? *(btw, how do you define educated by the looks? glasses? hehehehe)*

Seeing is believing, but sometimes the most real things in the world are the things we can’t see (The Polar Express).

I’m not saying what on the “inside”, either beautiful or not “physically”, they can either good or bad on the inside too, who knows? I’m saying in a superficial way, in general people who have good outside looks, tend to be proud of themselves, and they like to play “hard to get” and nothing wrong with that. Everybody deserves what they deserve to get, anyone! don’t get me wrong here and again, i’m saying that in general way what is happening in our society, well of course i might be wrong, i might be right too! it’s not a big deal, that’s all i’m saying.

(as written in my blog)

I think if you look thoroughly and patiently, beauty is apparent anywhere, in anyone, no matter what race and nationality, what skin or eye color.

Unfortunately, the media has bombarded us with the insane and out-of-this-world idea and standard of beauty. The perpetual size “0″, big breasts, straight hair, long legs, tiny waists, light skin. The truth of the matter is, women with all those qualities are the very tiny minuscule minority.

My idea of beauty is a laughing little girl, a smiling mother and her baby, a content mature woman who accepts who she is.

Self acceptance and love is the ultimate idea and basis of beauty. And brains. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, it is not skindeep, and it glows from within. When you feel beautiful, you will appear beautiful.

I truly believe in that.

dunnoo…world so absurd

I was just thinking.

Some of the guys might be offended by this one, but you know what? I now know why Indonesian guys are so shallow.. You have a wealth of pretty girls there; I mean the ratio to pretty girls to guys is high. What I mean by that is, is that there are plenty of pretty women to go around as opposed to handsome guys.. I noticed this by looking at all of my hubby’s friends on Facebook. These guys are like butt ugly and have all these gorgeous girls. I ask my hubby what is the deal with that? He agrees and states that it’s usually because they have the “dough” to get these pretty girls.

Just a little observation.. It just seems like Indonesian girls are a little more forgiving when it comes to looks, while Indonesian guys are a little on the shallow side.. At least all the Indonesian guys I’ve known so far at least.
Okay here’s another example: one of my hubby’s friend is short dark and ugly! Not that the dark part matters but he’s ugly otherwise.
He dates all these tall fair skinned Indonesian girls and that is all he usually prefers. It just perplexes me because he’s dark himself but is so shallow that he would never date a dark girl?

Case and point Indonesian guys are hypocrites. Yep sorry..

Okay here’s another example of Indonesian “shallow-ness.”

My mother and sister and in-law like to make fun of people in the mall that look like “so called maids”. Funny thing is my sister- in- law is just as dark as those people she is making fun of. So the whole thing doesn’t make sense. It’s as if though: If you are not carrying a Louis Vuitton bag or have on $500 shoes you’re automatically a “beneath” them or what not.

In my honest opinion people of all colors are pretty, I just wish folks wouldn’t be so superficial and hypocritical..

Okay done venting..

Yes i agree with you if some Indonesian men are hypocritical, what a shame..
Is your hubby’s friend who’s short and ugly is also rich? if so, that’s it then! fair skinned Indonesian girls (just like most of my Indonesian girlfriends) do not particularly interested in Bule but they like Indonesian men who are rich!
and those women with maid type who “usually” come from poor family (not necessarily true tho) are not preferable for Indonesian and bule seem to like dating them, suddenly put them in a good position, make them feel good. I’m not just saying all this is because i don’t like them, I even asked my husband why and of course he denied it and said that i was racist but i’m not! i think that’s the reality. The funny thing that happened for the next day, when we were at the airport, we both saw a couple, bule and Indonesian woman who look like maid, i did not say a thing but then my hubby said.. oh that’s the kinda woman you were talking about last night and i was just silent, i did not even clarify.
I am an observer person, especially people behavior, i’m not just judging them but i also try to understand, not to particularly try to find the answer, i just like the idea of knowing people in general, that’s all.
We all try to fit in, try to look good and if we can’t look good with what we have on the inside or out, then we try to find it from somebody else or something else, just like those rich ugly men who date fair skinned women and usually those women don’t really care with his looks because she’s already beautiful and money make them feel more beautiful (and again i’m not saying all those fair skinned women are either rich or poor).
Same thing with those women with maid type, dating with bule make them feel good and those bule, of course they don’t really care with their looks because I’m sure they get what they want from these women (not necessarily all about money, can be just for fun, one nite stand “self respect and companion”, etc, etc”)
It’s all about “looking good” and “feeling good” and nothing wrong with that, we can all do what works for us.

I’ve heard this “maid” tag in the Philippines too.
People would say, “Muka siyang katulong”… basically, she looks like a helper… or literally, her face is like a helper’s.

Similarly, western foreigners are often associated with the darker, shorter women.

These couples are usually further stigmatized by the assumption of the woman being a prostitute.

My wife is Javanese and I am Filipino-American. We easily can pass for both, until you hear our accents.

What a long hot arguments! You made it to bring up a hot issue.

I’m Indonesian, I’m dark and petite. I don’t feel inferior because of that. One thing I’ve learned is to love and be grateful of what I have as I believe that if you sufficiently love yourself you have the power to love others and see the beauty of the world in each tiny things, including in the people who are said to be not pretty.

PS: Brandon, your blog is as nice as your photos.

Physical beauty is a deep skin. After you interact with each other either in marriage or merely living together for years then you will go deeper into the inner beauty. You will hardly see the physical beauty anymore after years pass by with her.

Regardless your woman will still have a stunning exotic looking at her 50, and lacking of such inner beauty, and yet there is no way out, unless you get divorced or going through dramas with her. That means, everybody learns their own lessons, and there will be always another guy who bites the bait. This is life!

I used to work (in the States) with an Indo woman. She is a knockout by Western standards, though she did make a comment once about “if I looked better…” After I was able to contain my amazement at this comment, I told her that she is gorgeous…Tall, very slim, hair to her waist, narrow nose (is that considered maid-like in Indo?), bigger breasts than you’d expect on a body that slim. And a firecracker as well! Not to mention smart and ambitious. Of course I had a crush on her, even though she was far younger than I am. And yes, her skin is a beautiful tan color. And she’s hapa! Her dad is bule, I think.

Since discussion like this always ends up with a bunch of Indonesian women ACCUSING Indonesian men (like that SLUT Nez For example), I will try to balance it into another perspective…

Is this story familiar to you ?

Jack is a bald, fat, ugly, alcoholic, loser bule man and he is constantly rejected by the women in his country. In Indonesia, he is surrounded, approached and adored by many girls….

I know that this is not politically correct but since someone started it I will say that most Indonesian women are materialistic, hypocrite, spoiled, not independent, demanding, unfaithful and one of the CHEAPEST IN THE WORLD. There you go…

Why can I say that ?? because I am an adventurer (penjahat kelamin if you will) myself and I have hunted and compared many different girls in the world. I have been with Western (American, British, French, Spanish, Dutch, Hungarian, Czech) , Indian, Pakistan, Arabic (Algeria), Chinese, Filipinos, Thais, Japanese.

I can sort out the rank of girl CHEAPNESS by country as follows :

1. Thai
2. Filipino
3. Indonesian
4. Hungarian
5. Czech
6. Japanase
7. American
8. Chinese (PRC)
9. Spanish
10. Dutch
11. Arabic
12. British
13. French
14. Indian
15.Pakistani

How do I parametrize the rank ? by going to the countries, going to the clubs, hunting and counting how many girls per night me and my friends can fuck. Also some information from expatriate, foreign student, foreign UN officer etc.

May be may list is not statistically accurate, but ask any CPK (Certified Penjahat Kelamin). They will agree with the rank.

The fact that so many Indonesian women are SO CHEAP is because they are so materialistic and not willing to work hard.

They just expect one day any bule will come to their life and bring them into western country. After that, they expect their bule man to support their family in Indonesia.

So try to test the level of Indonesian women CHEAPNESS yourself. Whether you are a bule, Arabic or African guy (doesn’t matter as long as you are foreigner). Try to hanging out in big cities in Indonesia (Jakarta, Bandung, Surabaya, Medan) for a couple of hours, wear an expensive clothes, watches and shoes then rent a fancy car with driver. (sometimes just being bule and poor will also do the job, remember they are so slutty they will approach anything with bule complexity).

See within few hours, you will have few Indonesian sluts approaching you. And no they are not typical bar whore with G-String like the one you see on New York streets.

Most likely you will be approached by either college educated or uneducated, either good looking Indonesian or babu looking Indonesian girls… all type of girls… EASILY!

try yourself!

Indonesian finest :

cheap girls.

ps: Some of you will try to justify this slutty behavior by pointing out that Indonesia is a poor country. FYI India and Pakistan are also poor country, why their women are not sell themselves out like in Indonesia ???

I am an Indonesian-American and I can see where Anti NEZ is coming from. I’ve seen a lot of “cheap” girls too but I think many (not most or all, just many) are those who have very little chance of getting outside of their island. It’s disgusting and when they are with a western person, they act like they’ve forgotten how to speak Indonesian or they now have a weird accent. Give me a friggin break! They’ve never left the country and their guys spoke perfect Indonesian.

Those with rich/normal parents, like Priscilla mention, can go either way. They can have great parents who taught them well or they can be the most spoiled lazy ass girls I’ve ever met and I just want to slap them.

In the U.S. I have a professional job. Everything is literally 50-50. We have our own accounts and everything. The only two thing we finally did together is get a home loan and a car. There is no way I’d let my husband support me unless we really have to (if he gets a job transfer) and hopefully not for too long. Also, if I were single, there’s no way I’d be chasing after a guy because he’s rich. Both the guys I’ve been with were not rich when we met but since they’re all hard working so money comes naturally.

@Priscilla and Savitri,

You missed the whole point. Stereotyping is not (politically) correct (although sometimes it has statistical basis), but now (in this blog) we play a fun game called STEREOTYPING.

This is just a normal respond to generalization by few ladies here that Indonesian men are ugly and shallow (which to some point, I agree). Of course, you cannot just get away easily like that…

Stereotyping Indonesian men without expecting any reaction from Indonesian men is ridiculous… that’s why I am here to participate in this ‘fun’ game…

Your turn…

And to Savitri, I know many Indonesian ladies working in US and Europe. But most of them have a ‘bule’ husband, so of course life will be easier for them regardless of their education and experience.. We all know how difficult it is to get a work Visa in US and Europe for foreigner.

Me and other Indonesian men must have a really exceptional qualifications to go abroad (US, Europe, Middle East) let alone get a job there..

And no, marrying a foreign woman is not our options. Most of us don’t have money, and you know money is the most important thing for a man to get a woman, let alone a foreign woman, but of course this ‘social convention’ do not apply to women, they can still get men easily everywhere regardless the money (and even looks) they have (as long they are willing to spread their legs)…

So if you are an Indonesian women and working abroad, don’t be so proud of it, because all you have to do is offering your pussy to any foreigner (with exception to few women of course, like my sister who is working abroad because she is very qualified and educated)

NEZ, doesn’t apply to me. I’ve been in the U.S. since I was five. I did go to school in Indonesia for a little bit but my home is always here. So no, I was born in Indonesia but I’m as American as anybody else.

Just FYI, I didn’t sleep with anybody until I was engaged and only had two guys in my lifetime. I’m picky with the shoes that I wear I’d be retarded to not be with the guys I sleep with.

I’ve never dated an Asian. They just don’t appeal to me. The men I’ve been with never cared whether I make more than they do or if they have to cook on some nights and clean. Actually I don’t have any Indonesian friends here. I do keep in touch with those I met in Indonesia but none here.

My parents think I’m too damn liberal and independent (my husband think so too) but hey, it’s just who I am. I worked hard to get what I have now and it defines who I am.

My sister married an Indonesian born guy but he’s been a citizen for a while too… before he met her. He moved when he was a boy too. My sister was born in the U.S.

Oh, I don’t find a lot of Indonesian guys attractive either. When they’re young they’re doable but after they get married or comfortable they get fat or unkept. There are a handful of exceptions but for the most part that’s what I see. Yes I’m generalizing.

But it seems like the size of your body reflects how well off you are. I went to Indonesia last year and everybody thought I needed monetary help because I was so skinny in their eyes. They all wanted to fatten me up. WTF! Then they wanted to fatten me up with junk food. There’s just no way. All the gym time and the natural/organic goodness in my body would go to waste. It was tough eating there. The food was great but since I didn’t know if the chicken were happy chicken or full of man made hormones I felt a bit weirded out.

Man, one of my comments is in moderation… oh well… weird… I wrote it before the one that’s posted above.

Anyhow, NEZ, I think you’re a bit sexist. My friend in Australia (my Indonesian high school friend), she makes over $150,000 AUS and a citizen on her own. She has a steady boyfriend (3-4 years I think) but just not interested in marriage. She’s 33 and she hates it when her family nags her about the M word.

Most of my Asian friends do have a white or Asian-Americans partner/husband but all these ladies are US citizens or at least a resident (they could have gotten their citizenship a long time ago but they’re too lazy to do the paperwork — their family migrated here when they were kids) before they got together. Most of my friends migrated from the Philippines, Vietnam, Laos, or Korea and they all have jobs in their careers.

Hi Savitri, tell your friend in Australia this quote :

“Men age like wine, women age like milk”

Boy I really feel sexist…

Please let me know if you’d prefer that I moderate this post more aggressively and/or lock it down. I’ve seen a few comments in here that are not contributing to any sort of an intellectual conversation.

@Anti NEZ – your comment above referring to Indonesian women working abroad is unacceptable. Please refrain from that type of comment again.

Oh and BTW Savitri, You work in US. Nothing to be proud of. You’ve been there since you were five, your parents brought you there. Big deal.

So what I can imply is that most Indonesian women can get a job and living abroad because either :
1. They were born or raised there.
2. They are offering their pussies to foreign men.

Can you see the difference? Non-citizen Indonesian men has to work very hard to get a job in US ?? Sadly just because they don’t have any pussy to offer.

@Priscilla, my real name is Bejo, there you go… what is your real name ??

And Priscilla please stop pretending that you are an American girl married to Indonesian men. I know that you are an Indonesian girl…

I am sorry if my post is disturbing anyone, but we play a game called stereotyping here.

Someone generalizing Indonesian men as ugly and shallow, I respond by stereotyping Indonesian women as materialistic and cheap. Fair enough isn’t it ?

NEZ, arguing with you is useless. I’m not just proud to work in the U.S. I am proud to have accomplished everything on my own and doing well in my field. It doesn’t matter where I work. I actually want to work in Africa, for a non-profit in the field of education, but since I’m married and with a young family, I can’t quite do that. So hopefully I can when the kids are out of the house. I don’t know, Africa seems really interesting to me.

There is a lot to be proud of in working, whether you work outside of the home or as a great stay-at-home mom. To some people here I am super woman. I think I’m like anybody else but they are amazed at how I can work and handle the home, husband, and have an incredibly well mannered and intelligent child and also keep up with my hobby.

A lot of people don’t have jobs here right now and a lot of people who migrated here work very very hard and some are successful and some others are not as so. The same who have been in the U.S. for generations, they all have their share of hard and easy life. To all who tries their darnest I give them a proud nod.

Also, it’s not just foreigners, if your heart is set on being a gold digger or to dream of a life elsewhere, some will do what it takes, which will include things that many will find very disrespectful.

You claim to have slept with many women, there’s nothing great about that. Have you checked yourself for HIV?

Oh, not every woman wants to get married. There is nothing wrong with being with somebody and not be legally bound. My sister-in-law has been with her guy for 20+ years. Oh, isn’t Goldie Hawn and what’s his name not married either. What is a marriage? I chose to do it because it felt right but if it wasn’t the right guy, I’d be ok if I were unmarried until the day I die and donate everything I have to the humane society and an environmental group.

cantik itu relatif, jelek itu absolut.

*sorry brandon, cant help it, just add oil in fire, hekekekekek*

@Savitri, do you enjoy working in social or non-profit field ? I am seriously thinking about it as well..

I am thinking of giving up this corporate world someday (it’s soo damn booring) and become UN Peace Corps volunteer or WWF volunteer. Going to Africa to keep an eye on that crazy militant separatists or Saving rhino or orangutan in Indonesia seems a very intriguing idea …

It’s nice that we have something in common

@Priscilla yes I am bored:) haven’t slept for the last 24 hours working on this stupid project in Paris.

oh and yes it’s very nice to know that you are interested in Indonesian culture I think you are very sweet and open minded person..

I worked in the corporate world for 5 years and now in public (higher) education, 6 years. Pros and cons on both, and if pay is an issue, stick to the corp. I can make twice as much in corp. than edu. but I am much happier now. I get more gratification from my work and I do interact with more people too. Public edu is non-profit but not the type I want to do when I grow up. For that, I’ve only volunteered and it’s a different environment as a volunteer. I have friends who were/are in social/non-profit for a living and half loved it (and so now they’re elsewhere) and half loved it and they’re still there. It all depends on your wants and needs and most who quit are because of the pay in comparison to elsewhere for the same responsibility.

My undergrad is in psychology and mass communication and my grad is in technology and education. I’m kicking around a PhD in social psych but then an MD/health care sounds good too for my future non-profit venture. I guess I don’t need another degree to do it but I somehow feel I’d be more useful if I did — knowing how to work html, css, php and coldfusion isn’t going to help anybody there . I can teach though. So looking for a free way to get another degree… I haven’t paid for any of my higher education

I’m learning French too right now… in case I get to a French speaking African country… or any French speaking country for all it matters.

I donate $$ to animal protection but my non-profit venture will be for humans and education although again, if I did pursue another degree in health care I’d love to improve that aspect in 3rd world countries. Again, my family is still young and hubby has 10 more years to his current job. So I have a lot of years to think about this and prep.

J’aime beaucoup France. Je veux visiter la encore. Au revoir.

hmm well i’m a young american, don’t have a great job(military) or alot of family money. but my chinese-indonesian fiancee never cared about that or where i live or becoming an american citizen. she actually pleaded with me a few times to move there, which i can’t do cause of my job. she actually is more affluent and educated than i am, and as everyone i have met they have always commented on how “hot” she is. in her circle of friends and peers, she is the only one with a caucasian bf, and is always teased about it. her parents and grandparents have raised to her believe the most important thing is love not race or position, their only concern is her happiness and us have some plan for our future. but i have noticed like alot of others have said, she has on more than on one occasion commented on how she was too dark or wished she was whiter. even though that she as an ethnic chinese she is lighter than most ethnic indonesians.
i know there are people who marry for security and for beauty, for status and exoticism, for convenience and laziness.
why not for simple love. i don’t care if someone is white, hispanic, asian, or black, dark or light, poor or rich. there are beautiful women amongst them all. the important thing is who they are as a person how they treat me and how they treat themselves. i hate racism and stereotyping, no one should be proud of it. people are people. beauty is perspective, even though those women who not traditionally beautiful in ur culture might be in another way.
idk i know i’ve rambled slightly randomly but some of these comments piss me off. not because they might not be right on average but because they are right on average people treat everyone like that even if i their case its not like that. oh well

Wow!

What a long list!

Anyway,I would like to add too.

I think beauty is in the eye of the beholder,but many people still judge others by the cover of the book.Superficiality is everywhere.Its the norm,trend,convention,so to speak.Every society has their what is beautiful,accepted,ideal,respected etc and Asians,see white people and nearly everything from them as good,beautiful,the ideal etc.No suprise because most of the non-western world is developing to be modern and the developed modern nations are Western.

I’m from Malaysia,and every single time I go to a mall here,you will always see a white men+asian women couple.

of course this doesnt apply to all,but I think many of this couples came to be with race as among the main reasons or reason to get together.Meaning,they chose their partner with race as a main criteria.
In this,the girl will use her looks,charm etc to attract and get the guy,and for the guy,well,he “uses his race” to get her.How does he use his race? Well,he does it with the thought that his race will get what he wants and shows up wherever it is to get her.

I notice that many of the ladies with a white bf/husband tend to dress in a slutty-girly esque way.

It’s heaven if you get, 1. American salary 2.German cars 3.Chinese food 4. Indonesian wife

It’s hell when you get, 1. American wife 2.German food 3. Chinese cars 4. Indonesian salary….hehehehe…

I’m pure Indonesian, color skin doesn’t matter to me. As long as you fill each other up..

What an interesting exchanges between Savitry and AntiNez. Who is right or wrong? Who cares. I am more interested in ANtinez’s list of countries where I can find cheap P%^*y Now I need to start save some money. Poor me

I’m Batak’s girl from Medan – Indonesia, I’m Tall with a Bronze Skin and Bambi eyes … I Love it and Proud to be Dark Indonesia

I am Dutch. Here in Netherland Indonesian women are well known for being bitchy, materialistic and cheap.

That’s because Dutch people in Indonesia always go to shitty places like pubs n night clubs, Bernard.

beauty, like many other similar concepts, is cultural context, embedded with values, the way we perceive it indirectly unravels how multidimensional social system and structure work in certain societies

there’s one thing that bugs my mind in response to most comments posted here… those who were initiated by the simple-but-igniting thread tend to forget many other important aspects, such as the process of bule-lokal relationship and multiple elements which have important roles in it, and one more thing for sure, inclination of over generalization is quite disturbing…

Beauty is relevant. That’s darn cliche. However, for most Indonesian men, beautiful women are those with fair skin (such as Manadonese or Sundanese women), tall, straight hair, and “hidung mancung”. Whilst, for some (can’t really claimed majority of) western men, dark skin, small nose (including flat nose), and curly hair women are exotic and sexually more appealing than the other category. After all, doesn’t the first group a tad bit similar to the western women’s physical characteristics minus the blonde hair?
Rumput tetangga selalu lebih hijau dari rumput sendiri, right?
I personally believe in this theory. My case is the fact. I was born and grew up in Manado, but not a Manadonese. Growing up, particularly during my university years, I quietly accepted that no boys paid any attention to me (Halelujah, imagined if one of them did; I have ended up stuck in Manado with say, five or six children perhaps? LOL). To cheer up, I convinced myself that they just way too intimidated by my brain capacity
However, the moment I set foot in USA, I was indeed surprise by the whistles and hints the guys send to me. Get honks by male driver is an everyday routine. A man tried to grope me once when I jogged in a bright day light in a public place! I can’t sit alone at Starbuck reading my book without a man make an attempt for conversation.
I do admit that this realization that I have the ability to demand the male attention is quite beneficial when it comes to work. As a Registered Nurse (and proudly announced that I’m currently pursuing my nurse practitioner; in your face you Indonesian guys who paid no attention to me, hahahhhaaaa), majority of my male patients (young and old) are very nice and polite to me. And….brace for the most shocking news, the old ladies love my short nose. FYI, “Pesek” was the nickname the other kids at my elementary school unmercifully label me with as my nose shorter than theirs. Whoever said children are innocent creatures (LOL).
So…..for all the sawo matang, hidung pesek, rambut berombak, dan pendek girls alias nona/cewek rata2 (physically!) di Indonesia, don’t worry…..be happy, because in other parts of the world you are the beautiful ones.

PS: when I lived in Japan and the Philippines, I didn’t get much attention too, just like my Indonesia’s experience. Asian males prefer fair skin women.

This is a very interesting discussion. I think it is sooo cool for any culture to be able to view another and find beauty in those attributes which makes us physically different. I am an American white male who has befriended a beautiful dark skinned Idonesian woman. I can not understand why she finds me attractive and she does not understand why I think she is so pretty . . . hahaha. All I can say is I think I’m the lucky one.

Correction to my previous comment . . . Maaf . . . If I want to keep my dark skinned Indo friend, I better learn to spell Indonesian . . . hahaha. I try to write the best I can; but sometimes I have good luck and write better than I can . . .haha.

A note on the differences we have. We need to stop put a label on someone because of the color of one’s skin. Whether in Indonesia or in States (and some other countries I’ve visited) sadly but true, people are being judged by the color of their skins; unless they have money or power or both. I remember befriended a Papuan guy in my first year at the university in Manado after realized that none of the other students want to hang up with him, all just because he is a wee different than the rest of us.
In one party that I attended in Tokyo, where most of the party-goers were expats, a drunken Cambodian man blurted out his distrust of his Japanese “friends”. “They (the Japanese) just pretend to like you. They smile in front of you, but behind you they think you are nothing but a dirt. No gaijin (foreigner) worth a cent in their eyes.” A red-faced German (thanks to the free flow of drinks) in the circle nodded his head in synch.
Here in States, you’ll still find that group of people. And, by saying so, not only talking about the Caucasians but also the other ethnic groups. I remember being asked one day by an African-American girl at work, “Why is that I never see an Asian girl dates a black guy? Are you guys don’t like black people?” I was taken a back by her question/accusation and found my self all day long mulling on the issue: is that true?
My psych professor at the nursing school shared with us his experience on racism. Growing up, both mom and dad –although not openly declared their dislike of people of color– had imprinted on their children’s head the necessity to stay away of those who are different than them. Call it fear of the unknown. As he entered high school he decided to venture to the unknown territory and found the truth. He makes friend, very good friends, with some boys from the ghetto. His conclusion: if you afraid of something, get to know it. You’ll be surprise that you might just love it.
If we want to stop the war in this world of us, then start it by knowing the person who sit next to you in the class or at work. Start by smiling to the person who sit next to you on the bus. Don’t start the day by scanning one’s appearance. There are bad people out there, but one would never tell that by the color of their skins.

Hi Brandon, let me tell you about my own experience. I'm Indonesian woman and happened to be married with Australian. We been married for 10 years. My husband and I were friend for 2 years before we decided to bring our relationship into one step further. Both my parent are from Solo, Central Java and they both had this golden chocolate skin color.

The 1st one year of our marriage it's been very hard for me because all the comment that I had from the people surround us, the Indonesian people. Everytime we out for Dinner or a simply walking in the mall people always looking at my husband first and looking at me from top to toe – i was often getting upset because of this but I never tell my husband how upset I am.
Until one night my husband and I just coming back from a movie we decided to take a walk on the street for a while just to get a bit of exercise, nothing wrong with the way i dress that night, just a cotton blouse, a denim pant. After about 500 meters there's a bunch of man just outside circle K (the 24 hours shop) and one of them yelled and called me Pelacur or a prostitute in English word, my husband walk quickly toward that guy and without saying a word just show his left weeding finger and grab my left hand and show that man my weeding finger too, at the end He just said : “Dia Istri saya!!” and we walked away from them.
In another occasion people always called me with a a different nick name everytime my husband and I seen together.
Sad??..YES, HURT?? definitely…and very often i have to stop my husband from having an argument with other people who looked at me down.

Year two of our marriage We decided to have our Christmas in Australia, I was so worried with a number reason, here I am in my own country and i get treated so badly just because I'm a woman with a dark skin color and being married with a bule husband – and about to go outside the country, the country that full with Bule and different culture. My husband always said to me ” You will will be fine there! “.
He is right, NO ONE called me prostitute there, NO ONE looking at me with a strange look, NO ONE being rude to me…EVERYBODY are so nice and polite.

AND NOW, after 10years…I might have to thank to the people who once ever called me Prostitute, Pembantu, Hitam, Kampungan….because of them I become a woman who I am now.
NOW, I'm still a wife of a bule husband, a mother of 4 children and a Successful business woman.
The experience that I have who make me what I am now, the people who looked at me down become the people who motivated me the most.

Hi Brandon, let me tell you about my own experience. I'm Indonesian woman and happened to be married with Australian. We been married for 10 years. My husband and I were friend for 2 years before we decided to bring our relationship into one step further. Both my parent are from Solo, Central Java and they both had this golden chocolate skin color.

The 1st one year of our marriage it's been very hard for me because all the comment that I had from the people surround us, the Indonesian people. Everytime we out for Dinner or a simply walking in the mall people always looking at my husband first and looking at me from top to toe – i was often getting upset because of this but I never tell my husband how upset I am.
Until one night my husband and I just coming back from a movie we decided to take a walk on the street for a while just to get a bit of exercise, nothing wrong with the way i dress that night, just a cotton blouse, a denim pant. After about 500 meters there's a bunch of man just outside circle K (the 24 hours shop) and one of them yelled and called me Pelacur or a prostitute in English word, my husband walk quickly toward that guy and without saying a word just show his left weeding finger and grab my left hand and show that man my weeding finger too, at the end He just said : “Dia Istri saya!!” and we walked away from them.
In another occasion people always called me with a a different nick name everytime my husband and I seen together.
Sad??..YES, HURT?? definitely…and very often i have to stop my husband from having an argument with other people who looked at me down.

Year two of our marriage We decided to have our Christmas in Australia, I was so worried with a number reason, here I am in my own country and i get treated so badly just because I'm a woman with a dark skin color and being married with a bule husband – and about to go outside the country, the country that full with Bule and different culture. My husband always said to me ” You will will be fine there! “.
He is right, NO ONE called me prostitute there, NO ONE looking at me with a strange look, NO ONE being rude to me…EVERYBODY are so nice and polite.

AND NOW, after 10years…I might have to thank to the people who once ever called me Prostitute, Pembantu, Hitam, Kampungan….because of them I become a woman who I am now.
NOW, I'm still a wife of a bule husband, a mother of 4 children and a Successful business woman.
The experience that I have who make me what I am now, the people who looked at me down become the people who motivated me the most.

Bernard, here in Indonesia the dutch also well known as arrogant, loud mouth, and cruel. In our history book showed.

Bernard, here in Indonesia the dutch also well known as arrogant, loud mouth, and cruel. In our history book showed.

Quang, I feel very sorry for you. I feel sorry for your comment, your attitude, your ignorant.
She must be a very smart lady, who can leave that damage in your live specially in your brain – and I bet that lady is Indonesian.

Quang, I feel very sorry for you. I feel sorry for your comment, your attitude, your ignorant.
She must be a very smart lady, who can leave that damage in your live specially in your brain – and I bet that lady is Indonesian.

Sounds like Indonesia suffers from the same type of colonial mentality that the Philippines does. The perception that the lighter the skin, the straighter the nose, the better. Until the culture gets over that fallacy, they (like the Philippines) will remain backwards socially, economically, and politically.

Sounds like Indonesia suffers from the same type of colonial mentality that the Philippines does. The perception that the lighter the skin, the straighter the nose, the better. Until the culture gets over that fallacy, they (like the Philippines) will remain backwards socially, economically, and politically.

Sorry couldn't help but post here again. This next story proves that it doesn't matter if you're White, Black, Asian, Hispanic, Indian, there are just people who are just off.

In this story a crazy Asian wife handcuffs herself to her American husband so that they could “talk” lol So much for the “sweet and innocent” stereotype. lol
It was all over the news yesterday.

Handcuffed Husband Calls 911 During Biting Attack
Estranged Wife Cuffs Herself To Husband In An Attempt To Reconcile
Mans Call For Police Help Caught On Tape
FAIRFIELD, Conn. (CBS) ―

Some people will go to fisticuffs to get their point across, and others will go to, well, handcuffs.

Such was the case for a Fairfield woman having marital problems who desperately wanted to talk to her husband after he apparently decided to leave her, reports CBS station WCBS-TV in New York.

Helen Sun, 37, was arrested Tuesday after sneaking into Robert Drawbough's bedroom and handcuffing herself to him while he slept so they could talk.

Drawbough, frightened by his wife's antics, however, called police immediately and begged the dispatcher for help after his wife began biting and scratching him.

Rest of story here:

http://cbs13.com/national/handcuffed.husband.91...

Sorry couldn't help but post here again. This next story proves that it doesn't matter if you're White, Black, Asian, Hispanic, Indian, there are just people who are just off.

In this story a crazy Asian wife handcuffs herself to her American husband so that they could “talk” lol So much for the “sweet and innocent” stereotype. lol
It was all over the news yesterday.

Handcuffed Husband Calls 911 During Biting Attack
Estranged Wife Cuffs Herself To Husband In An Attempt To Reconcile
Mans Call For Police Help Caught On Tape
FAIRFIELD, Conn. (CBS) ―

Some people will go to fisticuffs to get their point across, and others will go to, well, handcuffs.

Such was the case for a Fairfield woman having marital problems who desperately wanted to talk to her husband after he apparently decided to leave her, reports CBS station WCBS-TV in New York.

Helen Sun, 37, was arrested Tuesday after sneaking into Robert Drawbough's bedroom and handcuffing herself to him while he slept so they could talk.

Drawbough, frightened by his wife's antics, however, called police immediately and begged the dispatcher for help after his wife began biting and scratching him.

Rest of story here:

http://cbs13.com/national/handcuffed.husband.91...

can I look who you are

can I look who you are

I think this guy is off base and lame. Man…. when I was in Indonesia I thought the women there were some of the most beautiful in the world. I look around my hometown in the US and I'm tired of the overweight, same faced white women and they do nothing for me. People need to judge their “own” on the same scale that we look at other nations. There's beautiful and ugly everywhere, but I just happen to think Indo is blessed with beauty.

I think this guy is off base and lame. Man…. when I was in Indonesia I thought the women there were some of the most beautiful in the world. I look around my hometown in the US and I'm tired of the overweight, same faced white women and they do nothing for me. People need to judge their “own” on the same scale that we look at other nations. There's beautiful and ugly everywhere, but I just happen to think Indo is blessed with beauty.

PS… I happen to be attracted to the same features and skin color that so many Asian women try to get rid of. Wake up wide nose, dark skin women… YOU ARE GORGEOUS!!!!

PS… I happen to be attracted to the same features and skin color that so many Asian women try to get rid of. Wake up wide nose, dark skin women… YOU ARE GORGEOUS!!!!

Indonesian men don't have the same respect for women as white men do. It's likely because of Islam.

Indonesian men don't have the same respect for women as white men do. It's likely because of Islam.

Yes you can't get American women, they have a high standard of men. So you turn to 3rd country women who will adore you like a god. Pathetic.

You are wrong. Islam respects women. Don't confuse Islam with Arabs. They have a primitive desert culture that remains…

And what kind of Indonesian men are you talking about ?? from the low class society in Jakarta ?? compare that with low class white thrash in major US or European cities and you won't see the difference.

My husband is an educated, respectful and responsible Indonesian man, also my father and brothers.

Most Indonesian educated men are respectful toward women, they are also more financially responsible and respectful toward older person & their parents compared to white men.

Indonesian men are taught from child that they are not only responsible for their family but also their parents and younger siblings. And no we don't have a good insurance and social security system like in western countries, so Indonesian men have to work very hard to afford it.

my being a “westerner” Australian guy i love indo girls, there beautiful full lips and wonderful big dark eyes and amazing think dark hair… and the bronzy skin mmmmm so nice.. they may not be as tall as other girls but they make up for that with the way they talk to you, they make you fell a million $ and the why they look after you.. i never feel hungry or sick. money is no problem i can give her my bank card and she is more likely to save money or add money to my acct than spend it.. her family is so friendly and the people in her city are or friendly… she is from Bandung.
but i cant say the same for MOST girls from Jakarta… im not saying ALL girls but most altho they look great sexy and all that they can be very money oriented and very bitchy but i have meet one javanese girl that was nice…. lol but only one…

When I am in Indonesia I am handsome. In my own country no women cares to look at me
The same indonesian men like some ugly western girl just because of their fair skin and blondie hair

Anyway, I´ve been married to a dark skin big teeth indonesian woman for 15 years and maybe for some indonesians sjhe´s ugly, but for me, she is still a queen.

Hey Quang, your comment is sooo offensive, you narrow minded man, i bet u r frigid

Hi Rhea, please dont only think that way.. indonesian bwomen are unfamiliar with the romantic treatment given by westerners, so, maybe that's why she was easily hooked by ur man

everything has its own beauty but beauty isn't everything (like i thought)

nice discussion..!!..i m indonesian…bule or not..i prefer man who care of me..so much…thats..all

Ive recently met a girl from jakarta on the internet by accident.I thought she was someone else,but we emailed each other for a couple of hours and i must admit,im kind of smitten already.she made some very nice gestures which made me wish it was easy to fly from england to indonesia.If it was so simple,id be on my way.I cant comment on the way of indonesian women,but based on what ive found with trina,i would love to go there.She has been online again today briefly and not spoke,so im assuming at this point that she was just in a hurry.I really hope she keeps in touch.Having seen some profile pictures of the girl,i must say that i would love to see her fo real and will do my utmost to keep in touch with the aim of flying out there sometime soon to meet her.AS FRIENDS only.

I think Indonesia is a beautiful country and think ALL men and women that marry should equally respect each other !!

I'm an American man who married an Indonesian woman. I have to say, I thought I was alone with some of the differences between my wife and I. To me and many other men in the US, she is very beautiful. In public she has a sweet soft gentle personality. When it’s just her and I, things are much different. Controlling, penny wise and pound foolish, insists on controlling the finances and many other aspects in our relationship. I have to beg for 5 dollars before I go out to work in the morning. She herself won’t buy herself a pair of socks without calling me on the phone at work to ask my permission. On the other hand, Absolutely 100% trustworthy.

I was 36 when I married her. Before her, There was not one women I could trust with all domestic aspects like I can my wife. They were all cheating, money grubbing selfish gimmie gimmie I want I want. I would come in the house after splitting wood for 3 hours on a Saturday morning only to be complained to about forgetting to put my coffee cup in the dishwasher before I went out. My current wife would be insulted if I took care of my own dishes.

I'm an American man who married an Indonesian woman. I have to say, I thought I was alone with some of the differences between my wife and I. To me and many other men in the US, she is very beautiful. In public she has a sweet soft gentle personality. When it’s just her and I, things are much different. Controlling, penny wise and pound foolish, insists on controlling the finances and many other aspects in our relationship. I have to beg for 5 dollars before I go out to work in the morning. She herself won’t buy herself a pair of socks without calling me on the phone at work to ask my permission. On the other hand, Absolutely 100% trustworthy.

I was 36 when I married her. Before her, There was not one women I could trust with all domestic aspects like I can my wife. They were all cheating, money grubbing selfish gimmie gimmie I want I want. I would come in the house after splitting wood for 3 hours on a Saturday morning only to be complained to about forgetting to put my coffee cup in the dishwasher before I went out. My current wife would be insulted if I took care of my own dishes.

My heart suddenly beat faster when I start writing this LOL! I've read all the 106 comments in this topic. I am Indonesian, and I am pure Bataknese. I was born with a yellow skin. Since I was teenager, I have always been attracted to a Bule men, especially their colorful eyes. But I did falling in love with Indonesian men too, and most of them were the one with fair skin.
I believe Brandon -which happened to have experience lived 7 years in Indonesia might have known the culture of Bataknese. In Bataknese, men are kings, and women are the king's assistance. A conventional Bataknese is racist; thinks that their race is better than any other race in Indonesia. I am forbidden to marry other than a Bataknese men, which I have never been succeeded building a relationship with one.
And when I turn older, I am now 30 yo, I started getting so much pressure on why I still alone. My dad told me, “When you are 30 yo and above, men will not like you anymore cos they will find younger girls.” But with so much pressure, I still have to marry a Bataknese, other race will not be considered at all in my parent's sight.
And this is difficult for me. I am not as fair as most Indonesian pretty girl/woman standard is. But, if I want to fulfill my dream in marrying a Bule, I am not as tan/dark as most Indonesian pretty girl/woman in Bule's standard X(
But then another stronger problem has emerged since 2006. I have faced the reality that most Bataknese and Indonesian men would turn me out just because I wasn't a virgin (I slept with only 1 man whom I loved so much -and I regretted it).
That's why the will to marry a westerner growing bigger inside me each day, not because they can offered me money (I have a job, I am well-educated), but because I know exactly how open-minded a westerner can be in a subject of virginity, and how they will love and accept us just the way we are.
Nowadays, I do not envy those girls with fairer skin, I envy those with darker skin :p

Anti NEZ for your records, I'm chinese-indonesian woman, was an overseas uni student, currently working in finance for government here and hell no, I didn't marry my husband for the sake of getting a job and living abroad. I met my husband here in Sydney when I was studying and we were dating for 4 years before we finally married for nearly 5 years now. And, he's my first and last BF-now husband. We love each other to death and I'm a very independent woman and hate to hear your sick comments. Please think carefully before you speak.

i from bali….i agree with you……

hi…i from bali i stay in USA that not true,…american women is the same like other women in the world, they don`t have a high standard of man? what are you talking about? some women are nice, some women a bitch…..my friend from texas going to bali visit me last years, she is falling love with balinese man….you never know……..not all indonesian man is ugly,,,,,,,,,,and not all indonesian women like white man….mostly balinese women tell you in the trut………

I'm Indonesian married to American and I'm not a mail bride order or a maid. Luckily I don't look like Indonesian but I'm proud being Indonesian. I met my American husband here in the State year of 2000 and been married for 6yrs now.

All that needs to or can said,has been.
i'm a 37 yr old english guy with a basic security job,little money,no real family to speak of,standard high school education. i'm involved with a 27 yr wolio woman from south east sulawesi.

The woman in question knows my past and present. i have never felt so trusting or trusted. yes,the usual comments by various indo men were made, but she held her own and i bit my tongue.
her family give me so much respect(and damn good home cooking,i might add) i'm no oil painting but to feel the way i do now because of this woman i met, well, you do the math.
she's dark, i'm a milk bottle, but i will never back down or lose my cool when hearing such offensive comments again. indo men will see things from a different angle, as will the bule, but if u have the drive to get through it all, good for you .
now, i'm back in sulawesi in september to eat my girlfriends parents out of house and home. her mother seems proud of my love for indo food ,dad,because i feel so at ease in their home and get to eat in the kitchen as one of the family(i'm not a guest anymore,i'm told)

no doubt, i will get annoyed by sly comments directed at my amazing and very indah istri, but she can kick ass as much as i can. i pity the next taxi driver or 10 to when making such abusive comments when we meet up at kendari airport. remeber guys, indo or bule, hell have no fury

so., dadah

I agree with you. Here in the US Indonesian women are very calculating and,cunning, focused on money and bichy as well.

Unfotunatly I met one indonesian women from java particularly bichy and very sneaky.

I agree with the opinion of Bernard, a Duch man from Netherland . I am American. Here in the US Indonesian women are well known for being bitchy and materialistic as well. I have a very bad experience with meeting of Indonesian women. They do not have any moral restrictions, insidious cunning and greedy.

Girl, you have a lot of issues you need to address. Maybe if you had a man you would feel differenly. And you are certainly not maha as you name suggests.

To all of you that have lived in Indonesia or have visited there a long time I would like to ask a question in regards to race. I've seen postings in a dating site where Indonesian women request that no African or black men pursue them or leave messages. Please tell me what's going on with this. Is it racism or some cultural quirk I haven't become aware of. I'm trying find out all I can about this beautiful country before I visit. I'm american and am mixed with native american, european, and african. There's not toomuch I cant handle when it come to races. Please help me get past this with any experiences you may of had. Thank you very much.

Here “Londo” aka Dutch men are well known as Bi. Love to do sodomi. Even my granpa said German was thousand times better. And he compared what Dutch did here worst than Nazi. At least Hitler helps us by sent Kriegmarines to kick your orange ass. Did you know that Nazi graveyard are treat better than Dutch here? lol

Are you blind or gay? LOL Or a frigid maybe? ROFL

Another shallow. LOL Go back to school or read some books!!! LOL I suggest you to read some of Karen Armstrong's books.

Here in Indonesia yankees men are well known as shallow.

Racism is the same around the globe,pal. But what happened here more to “behaviour”. What Chinks did here too aroggant for Indonesians. They (chinks) acts & keep a mind like in colonial time,where they're 2nd class and Indonesians were 3rd class. In fact we own our land and they're just immigrant here. It's so weird if they still act like a master in our land. That's why it was so irritating and then it just happened. LOL

You interested to have Indo?

Hi Everyone,I stumbled on this site after meeting a girl from Jakarta and thought to do some light research.At the moment we are friends but definitely want to take it further in the future.
Can anyone give me some advise or information about Jakarta women?

Good for you ! “In every adversity comes the seed of a far greater benefit” Napolean Hill and W. Clement Stone. I am happy for you and for you overcoming this. Those people saying nasty things about you were ignorant and bigotted and you are better off to be rid of them. I wish you much happiness ans success in the future.

Hallo bu, my name is Jessica. I am 16 years old – my mother is Indonesian and my father is American. I never really thought about this topic before – I knew that some people did criticize Indonesian women of darker skin who married a foreigner in the ways thatyou havedescribed though very rarely – i never really thought about it – i didn't giveit a second though but after reading what you have went through I feel so disgusted. That is terrible and I'm so sorry that had ever happened to you. If it makes you feel any better – my mother is dark skinned and I believe she isthe most beautiful in the world – and I am sure you are too. You are a true indonesian woman – those white indonesian chicks, trying on all desperate attempts with so many skin products to make themselves white are trying to be what they are not, they are not embracing their culture – BE FIERCE AND BE CONFIDENT because baby, dark skin is GORGEOUS – screw those men who called you such disgusting names – they are complete idiots.

With Love,
Jessie

I see this comment a lot. It's very funny. The comment always goes something like this…. western guys can't get women in their own country so they come to Indonesia to be like a king or something. Well I live in America, make good money and have a beautiful blonde, green eyed wife. I go to Indonesia for a few months for business and have a dark, skinny, black-haired even more beautiful Sundanese girl. The Indonesian women are superior. When I come back to the U.S., I always see people staring at my wife.

High rise, I don't think you got it wrong. I noticed the same thing on TV as well. I'm an American too and have brown skin and was fascinated by the dynamics of race in Indonesia too. It's sad to say but they put the white skin on a pedestal. My skin color was the same as the Indonesians. I didn't have any problems there at all, I think because of money, but my black friends could not make the hook up. One of the brothers was even refused at a whore-house.

Well said, Aulia.

It's very interesting topic. It reminds me of my own point of view to be beautiful. Back to 10-15 years ago in Bandung, as an Indonesian woman I would be afraid to be under the sun because I didn't want my brown skin becoming darker. The stereotype of having light skin is much prettier was somehow stacked in my mid, and for sure always looked very good with fancy cloth and shoes when I went out was the most important thing. I always considered what other people would think about my appearance. However, things were changed. By having worked and studied in Europe, and now even get a permanent residence in one of western European country without getting married or having relation with any “bule”, are really open my mind and perspective of beauty. Beauty is not from the skin color or how you look in front of other people, but beauty is more reflection of your personality and how you behave and respect other people. So again..beauty is relative and being brown or darker doesn't mean ugly